World Background

Coordinator
Jan 16, 2012 at 5:05 PM

So I thought its better to have a seperate thread to the story line thread, just for the background of the world.

About the rest of the Runewar: still translating what I wrote (I was lazy last week, thats why it takes so long)

 

Now for something I want to discuss with you. Since the Runes are based on the Elements of the world (at least in my imagination), we need Elements.

1. How many Elements should we have?

2. Which Elements do you think would fit (Just write what element you think would be good, you are allowed to be creative, we all know the regular ones, but maybe we can come up with new ones)

ad 1. I think there should be at least 3 (but rather 4) and 7 at most

ad 2. Just saying: We have the Greek elements (Water, Earth, Fire, Air), Eastern elements (Water, Wood, Fire, Earth, Metal)

 

Please share your opinions

Editor
Jan 16, 2012 at 8:00 PM

In my opinion we should habe 6 elements, 4 basic elemnts (water, air, fire, earth) and death and live, maybe for example a water rune itselfs has some effect, combined with a death rune it causes more damage/whatever and combined with a liverune it health you..just as example..

Editor
Jan 16, 2012 at 9:21 PM

I could go for the normal elements, maybe make monsters and stuff that combines them.

Like my mud monster, it could be a combination of earth and water, and flame attacks would harden it into hard clay and make it immobile or very slow.

if we figure what elements to include I could try to sketch up some variants.

Coordinator
Jan 21, 2012 at 2:31 PM
Shyralon wrote:

In my opinion we should habe 6 elements, 4 basic elemnts (water, air, fire, earth) and death and live, maybe for example a water rune itselfs has some effect, combined with a death rune it causes more damage/whatever and combined with a liverune it health you..just as example..

I don't like the idea of "basic" elements and "advanced" elements. I think all elements should be equal and combinable with every element. Try combining Life and Death ;). Not only is each of them the opposite of the other but actually the lack of the other. Some kind of Life element might be an idea, but Death doesn't really fit in my opinion

Editor
Jan 22, 2012 at 12:31 AM

how about we have some completely new elements, like Movement, intelligence, life and force

So creatures of the Movement element are quite fast, while force creatures are strong and can take more hits, while intelligence are good strategists. Life creatures could have several lives before they are defeated.

Editor
Jan 22, 2012 at 12:04 PM
Edited Jan 22, 2012 at 12:25 PM

I agree with F4celess... their all good idea's and would be great in a game like this, but in my opinion we shouldn't have several lives before they actually die. over 5 lives is to many for a character to defeat... specially if any of these elements were to be combined together to form a "Boss" form of a creature (you know like where you defeat the wingmen people (cant think of the word i think its minyans (spelt wrong)  then you have got to kill the boss, i cant think of the right word sorry). 

 

I suggest 6 at MAX maybe 3 or 2 lives when combined with either the "Force" and "Intelligence" elements.

 

Editor
Jan 22, 2012 at 1:12 PM
Ammonium wrote:

I agree with F4celess... their all good idea's and would be great in a game like this, but in my opinion we shouldn't have several lives before they actually die. over 5 lives is to many for a character to defeat... specially if any of these elements were to be combined together to form a "Boss" form of a creature (you know like where you defeat the wingmen people (cant think of the word i think its minyans (spelt wrong)  then you have got to kill the boss, i cant think of the right word sorry). 

 

I suggest 6 at MAX maybe 3 or 2 lives when combined with either the "Force" and "Intelligence" elements.

 

I didn't think we should give some Life enemies 5-6 lives, more like 2. and they would be unable to do anything while they are regenerating for another life. for a Boss I think a boosted combination of 2 elements would be good, and maybe have a variant with all of them combined in the end. the end boss could change it's element from one life to another. morphing into a different form while regenerating.

also, it's called Minions

Coordinator
Jan 26, 2012 at 8:10 AM

I like the idea of creating completely new elements.

Life, force (movement included), light (fire included), material (earth, water, air included), intelligence.

Editor
Jan 27, 2012 at 4:25 PM

I think I would make life, death (but without any combinations, maybe only for special bosses, but life without death is..crazy..), energy (for fire, maybe shadow and light, with light you make enemys blind and shadow hides you) and material with another name, I think there is no need for intelligence...

Coordinator
Jan 27, 2012 at 6:07 PM

You need some element for runes showing rune effects, altering someone's mind, etc. You can make up an other name, but where do you put these runes without this element?

Editor
Jan 27, 2012 at 10:13 PM

IMO it's getting complex. But I'm not going to complain. because my idea for this are already posted.

Editor
Jan 28, 2012 at 8:59 AM

YOu mean some kind of mind control etc? Could be a good idea, but I think to much elemnts is too complex^^

Coordinator
Jan 29, 2012 at 5:10 PM

Okay my general thoughts on your discussions. Just something you should have in mind with the elements:

1. They are what the world and every being there is made of.

2. Elements are something really basic. Those are the smallest parts, kinda like atoms, but more simple.

3. Everything is made of all elements, but different amounts of each element. This causes diversity. If one element is missing, then this means death (It's the same in every human elemental system and I like the idea. Thats also why I don't like the idea of death as an element)

 

Those are pretty basic thoughts about what elements should be. These 3 points should be considered when thinking up new elemens. I think Darress first thoughts about elements sound interesting. But creating new elements will be a big challenge. After all, each element must have aspects which only this element possesses and it has to be able to interact with other elements.

Coordinator
Jan 29, 2012 at 5:43 PM

As I can see, you see things better than I do. Maybe you could come up with your ideas, and we could try to add ours, or alter yours to create something harmonic.

Editor
Jan 29, 2012 at 8:41 PM

How about we take the normal elements. as in the physical elements, and then add specializations. like my previous idea. If anything it helps us come up with different creatures and characters.

Think like you have two fire beasts. Both use fire. but one have Strength as it's secondary element, while the other has intelligence. and that makes them behave differently. one is a tank, other is a ninja.

Like I said, the players don't even have to notice we have a system like that. it just helps us collectively figure out what kind of enemies we need.

Coordinator
Jan 30, 2012 at 7:08 AM

Maybe it is becoming too complicated.

My question is: why is this needed. Maybe it is good to categorize the runes, but I think it can't be good, if we have more levels.

Coordinator
Jan 30, 2012 at 10:01 AM
F4celess wrote:

Think like you have two fire beasts. Both use fire. but one have Strength as it's secondary element, while the other has intelligence. and that makes them behave differently. one is a tank, other is a ninja.

 

How about then, one has air as secondary element: flows like the wind. The other has earth as secondary element: strong like the ground.

You can be creative with basics too. Actually you can be more creative with basics then with specials.

Editor
Jan 30, 2012 at 7:22 PM
Evo_Kaer wrote:
F4celess wrote:

Think like you have two fire beasts. Both use fire. but one have Strength as it's secondary element, while the other has intelligence. and that makes them behave differently. one is a tank, other is a ninja.

 

How about then, one has air as secondary element: flows like the wind. The other has earth as secondary element: strong like the ground.

You can be creative with basics too. Actually you can be more creative with basics then with specials.

I totally agree with that, 4 basics (fire, water, earth and air) for example water+fire=steam, water+ earth mud(f4celess mud creature for example) air+water= ice and so on..

Editor
Jan 31, 2012 at 7:39 AM

Evo_kaer: Do you have details about what kinds of enemies you imagine the world would host? Since you are the writer and all you have the best vision of what fits the story and whatnot. Without real input on what you want for beasts and other NPC's I can only draw random stuff and hope they fit the story.

I'm aware that I'm both slow and late with what I'm tasked with. On top of a full time job I have had weekends full of events for a while. not much time for art.

Coordinator
Feb 1, 2012 at 6:00 PM

Finally, I've finished the Runewar part of the Background story. See the Background wiki if you wanna read it

@F4celess: I have no idea about enemies or the like. I'm trying to develop the story in a way that lets you have enough freedom for your own ideas. Currently the only requirements demanded by the story are: dragons, runes, some kind of humanoids. And those were defined before anyway ^^.

About the elements: now that I've finished the Runewar, i finally can concentrate on this (The Runewar was occuping my mind until now)

@Darress: I will stick to this ancient evil causing the runewar, BUT I will extend the Creation of the Runes part, so that ancient evil gets a face and name. I hope this is okay for you. And about that "how is one dragon supposed to destroy some ancient evil force that wiped out most of the dragons". I've already got an idea for that, so don't worry ;)

Coordinator
Feb 2, 2012 at 8:01 AM
Edited Feb 2, 2012 at 8:17 AM

Ok, I just said my opinion, but dont worry, I trust you.

Anyway the background story is very good. :) I'm glad you are in the team.

Coordinator
Mar 5, 2012 at 4:14 PM

Sooooo, here comes some new stuff from me, since nobody has posted something in here for quite some time (I hope that is going to change soon, I like this project and the world I'm creating for it ;) and would hate to see it die)

So first of all, read -->This<--

I added the first part of the creation of the world, I started at the very beginning. I think each of you should read it, because I think that way you might get a better feel of the world I imagine.

Second:

Here's my idea for a symbol for a dragon god, which is actually the fusion of the two dragons in my creation story, but I will add that later:

http://evo-kaer.deviantart.com/art/Alternative-Yin-Yang-288743861

You can read about how I got this idea in the description of the picture. I know its just a really basic scratch, its only black and white without different hues. I'm not very much of an artist (well at least on computer)

 

Third:

I think I may have completed my element system. The elements are separated into two categories: energy and matter (you can also read that in the story).

Matter: Earth and Water (I know reeeeaaaally mainstream, but I just imagined a world where I would be new and water and earth are about the first thing you recognize, at least in a world that is comparable to the earth)

Energy: Light and Heat (I always wondered why nobody ever thought of light being an element, I mean fire is all good, but the sun emits light and it has not been known for long that there actually burns something on there)

I could come up with some examples to explain that system, but I think it will be a lot more interesting for you and me if you give me something which you can't imagine to work with this system. That way give you some insight into the philosophy I thought of (which I can't put into words) AND the whole system gets tested in a way I couldn't possibly accomplish on my own.

 

Forth:

Some ideas for dragons. I came up with some stuff that will on one hand make the dragons appear seemingly immortal, while giving an explanation, why they could have gotten extinct.

  • Dragons are born from the elements. Its a pretty rare event where all factors are just right. So they are not born like animals. This explains, why they haven't overpopulated the world already.
  • They are generally immortal, since they have such a strong connection to the elements. If a dragon dies, he decides so on his own becoming one with the world once again.
  • After the runes were created, this connection was weakened since the dragons split up into clans which mostly identified only with their respective element. This led to less dragons being born.
  • After the runewar the dragons broke all bounds withv each other and hid among the regulars. This caused their elemental connection to weaken even more. The conclusion was that no dragons were born anymore and the remaining dragons died of old age instead of being immortal. Their life span is still high, but with no new dragons being born, they are nearing extinction.

 

Pretty long post, I know. I hope you guys read it and add your two cents.

Editor
Mar 6, 2012 at 1:02 PM
Edited Mar 6, 2012 at 7:24 PM

Just my opinions on the stuff you mention

First part:

- good readin. maybe a bit complex but that shouldn't be in the way of the actual main quest. Rather something to dig into for the players who are interested.

- When you write the story for actual gameplay. write it in short chapters and be as detailed as possible. makes it easier for all of us. describe distance and size and whatnot. Think of how the story can be split into several parts so players can go sidequesting or just exploring.

Second:

- It's a start, a good start. I'm sure I could "improve" it. I'm currently trying to learn Adobe Illustrator, So I'll see if I can make something out of your idea, unless of course. you want to do it yourself.

EDIT: check link below

third:

- I support these elements, Looks like a good spinoff from the normal cliche-elements. About the light element. Is there a shadow element or is it just the lack of light? Also, Fire emits light. That's a connection not found in water and earth as both can exist without each other. Light on the other hand is created by heat in almost any realistic case.

(that's the only issues I could come up with about the elements.)

- Sub categories could be nice tho.

Fourth:

- Dragons being born like that and all sounds fine to me.

- Would the main quest be to regain the dragons immortality?

______________________________________

I did a variant of the logo by tracing Evo's original and adding my own details.

http://0o2471.net/37894

(hope you like the "signature" I made for you Evo)

Coordinator
Mar 6, 2012 at 3:17 PM
F4celess wrote:

First part:

- It's a good read. maybe a bit complex but that shouldn't be in the way of the actual main quest. Rather something to dig into for the players who are interested.

- When you write the story for actual gameplay. write it in short chapters and be as detailed as possible. makes it easier for all of us. describe distance and size and whatnot. Think of how the story can be split into several parts so players can go sidequesting or just exploring.

I'm creating this whole background for different reasons. One is definitely for getting a better feel of the world, so we can make more reasonable. Another is the basic reason why I qquit almost all MMORPGs I ever started after a short time: They lack story. And the only way you can overcome this, is to give ome history to the world. I know this isn't going to be an MMO, but my experiences have told me, that if there is more to learn in a game than your own story which you are playing, you are getting sucked into it. All the Elder Scrolls parts are perfect examples of this.

About the plot: I will, but first I will only create a rough plot and get into detail later (unless I come up with details early). First the rough plot should be good, before I (or we) waste to much time on something that we don't approve of.

F4celess wrote:
Second:

- It's a start, a good start. I'm sure I could "improve" it. I'm currently trying to learn Adobe Illustrator, So I'll see if I can make something out of your idea, unless of course. you want to do it yourself.

Like I said, I'm not that great of an artist, I'm an engineer, so you can expect drawings from me, which are perfectly scaled ;) but thats about it. I would love to see, what you can do with my basic idea. So feel free to experiment

Coordinator
Mar 7, 2012 at 5:34 PM
F4celess wrote:

third:

- I support these elements, Looks like a good spinoff from the normal cliche-elements. About the light element. Is there a shadow element or is it just the lack of light? Also, Fire emits light. That's a connection not found in water and earth as both can exist without each other. Light on the other hand is created by heat in almost any realistic case.

(that's the only issues I could come up with about the elements.)

- Sub categories could be nice tho.

What you say is mostly right. Shadow would be the lack of light, yes. Fire is light and heat combined. The next part will be a little philosophical.

It doesn't matter how hot water gets, it will never emit light (as far as i know). So heat alone causes no light. But you're right that most stuff you heat up enough either starts to burn (wood) or glows from heat (metal). And NOW it gets philosophical: Since I already told you, that everything is made out of all elements (with different amounts of each) and a lack of one causes death, lets take a tree for example. Its body is made of earth, water runs through its veins, fire keeps it from cooling out and therefore dying and light gives it life. Now we heat the tree by a lot. Usually the heat inside the tree would be pretty low, enough for it to live, but not enough to be able to move a lot. So if there is too much heat, it causes an overload of one element, the heat breaks out and all elements depart: the water vaporizes, the earth is turned too ashes (only another form of earth), the light and the overload of heat come out in the form of fire.

I hope you could follow my thoughts ;)

F4celess wrote:

Fourth:

- Dragons being born like that and all sounds fine to me.

- Would the main quest be to regain the dragons immortality?

______________________________________

I did a variant of the logo by tracing Evo's original and adding my own details.

http://0o2471.net/37894

(hope you like the "signature" I made for you Evo)

I would rather say: "Returning the dragons to their former glory", but kinda, yes

And that logo looks awesome. Nice work!

Editor
Mar 7, 2012 at 9:32 PM
Edited Mar 8, 2012 at 5:59 PM

Ty. Still a lot left to do with it.

Coordinator
Mar 15, 2012 at 7:09 PM

I just created a rough timeline draft for all of my ideas (which are a lot more than are written down atm). You can find it at the top of the general Background page --> Here <--

You might get a better view of everything with this.

@Darress: That evil force now has a face ;) I hope this is more like what you imagined ^^

Coordinator
Mar 16, 2012 at 11:02 AM

Wow, thats pretty nice. I see you have been working. :D Something that we were not doing lately. Good job.

Editor
Mar 16, 2012 at 5:17 PM
Evo_Kaer wrote:

I just created a rough timeline draft for all of my ideas (which are a lot more than are written down atm). You can find it at the top of the general Background page --> Here <--

You might get a better view of everything with this.

@Darress: That evil force now has a face ;) I hope this is more like what you imagined ^^

Great, spawned many ideas. Like the holy mountain being to mountains smashed together with the evil dragon inbetween, making it a twin mountain.

Coordinator
Mar 17, 2012 at 9:32 AM

Yes, the evil now has a face. ;) Nice work! I enjoyed reading it.

But I think light and heat are pretty the same. If the weather is too hot, the grass will catch fire and will emit light. And there is an other problem with these elements, I think they do not cover all things in the world. Love and life is energy too. Is it light or heat? And intelligence is energy too.

Coordinator
May 13, 2012 at 1:26 PM

So its become pretty silent in here. It seems too me that this project is kinda on break, with a little bit coming up now and then. I have been silent also for quite a while (2 months that is). That was because I wanted to try something. I've observed before, that if I had posted something new everyone seemed excited and new ideas were flowing. But if I wasn't, almost nothing came. Seeing how it went those last 2 months I think I can safely say that my first observations were indeed correct.

2 months with almost nothing new is a long time. I understand that you all have private lives, but 2 months is long nonetheless. I know that some stuff is going on behind the scenes and we should start sharing these, otherwise everyone will think the project is dying. (I know, I'm one too talk, keeping my stuff to myself for over 2 months)

 

So let me start: http://forgottenrunes.codeplex.com/wikipage?title=Elements

I updated the Elemental System and added Air and Life as Elements. Light now represents intelligence and free will, while life is the ability to move to say it simple.

Other things I'm currently working on, but mostly aren't ready for showing right now:

  • I'm working an a language for the dragons, whenever I get new ideas. So far I've come up with slight gramatics and a few words. If you've read my stories closely, you might have found one.
  • Races. A lot about them. Which ones, general behaviour, how their communities work, what crafts they specialize in and so on. Still just a bunch of random ideas which need organization and A LOT of pondering.
  • Starting to think about the history of the races, without the dragons. A pretty important point since the dragons had almost no influence in the history of the other races (apart from kinda creating them through the creation of the runes)
  • Refining the whole story

Maybe I'll have something new to see soon from you guys. Definitely expect something from me

Coordinator
May 16, 2012 at 8:22 AM

Thats awesome man. I really looking forward for the races list and the history of them.